Elaphe hub motor, right to repair, possible performance upgrades

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Elaphe hub motor, right to repair, possible performance upgrades

Aptera Community Aptera Discussions Elaphe hub motor, right to repair, possible performance upgrades

  • Elaphe hub motor, right to repair, possible performance upgrades

  • Donald Kraper

    Member
    October 29, 2021 at 7:30 am

    I don’t post a lot but try to keep and eye on things. I am also an investor.

    After reading several posts as well as watching the Aptera SWOT Youtube video, the thought of a “New American Sports Car”has stuck in my head. (well done Ifi7929501)

    Aptera is quick, light, and power to weight ratio is excellent. With 70hp at each wheel (x3), and the 250 mile range battery pack, it will be the quickest set up from the factory.

    I have been wondering:

    Does Elaphe manufacture a hub motor that will fit the Aptera with more Horsepower?

    Is there the capability to allow the batteries to dump maximum energy to the hub motors?

    If so, this could be something special. One of the most efficient cars out there for $25k…that, with a change of hub motors could be a rocket on wheels, and still be considered very efficient. I have no idea if Elaphe has a motor that could work, nor do I know the price of each one if they were available. But if they were, I might be first in line to do the swap. Even if the costs of the motors were,$5k-7k a piece, you could end up with an extremely quick ride for under $45k.

    These are random thoughts, wondering if anyone else is thinking along these lines…(maybe I’m just trying to relive my days of stuffing a big block in a Vega)

  • BRUCE MENGLER

    Member
    October 29, 2021 at 7:47 am

    APTERA charges $2,500 to upgrade from 2WD to 3WD; which adds a third motor to rear wheel.

    • Donald Kraper

      Member
      October 29, 2021 at 7:51 am

      Correct. 70hp per wheel x 3. 210 hp

      But what if Elaphe has a 100hp hub motor that could be swapped? Now we could have 300hp.

      My reservation is for 3 motors/400 range, but may be changing that to a 250 range to remove weight.

      • Peter Jorgensen

        Member
        October 29, 2021 at 8:12 am

        Actually, the Elaphe M700 is rated for 75 KW max (100 hp) but Aptera has had it de-rated to 50 KW (67 hp). So the motor is already capable of more. There may or may not be a way to unlock the rest of that potential in the controller. I’m not sure if it was de-rated for efficiency or cooling. Something to look into…

        The other thing to be aware of is that’s 516 ft-lbs per wheel. That’s a lot of torque and will just spin tires. So the critical thing there is good traction control. According to Chris Noir will already burn rubber VERY easily. Adding more power will help at the higher speeds though – faster 60-90mph pulls and whatnot.

      • Ray Holan

        Member
        October 29, 2021 at 11:28 am

        Don, I ordered the 25kW pack with AWD for the very reason you mentioned — quickest acceleration. I’d love to see a graph displaying the number of pre-orders for each of the Aptera configurations.

  • George Hughes

    Member
    October 29, 2021 at 12:07 pm

    The issue with speed racing the Aptera is the RPM limits of the in-wheel motors. This limit has little effect on torque or acceleration but limits top speed as the motors ‘red line’ so to speak at 1,500 rpms. Doing the math with a 16″ wheel, adding some circumference for the tire and you get a top speed of between 100-110 mph. Up wheel size to 21″ and you could probably hit 130 mph.

    This means that even at the drags, while the Aptera will be an eighth-mile marauder, at quarter-mile distances, the Aptera is at a disadvantage to other cars that have higher top speeds.

    Out of the box, and knowing this might be a ‘fight’ because of the autocycle three-wheel designation, the Aptera might be a competitor in the autocross competitions given its wider than ‘wide-track’ geometry and tunable torque vectoring. Getting the Aptera ‘classed’ is the challenge for this and/or track racing where its strength of acceleration and ‘presumably’ handling would make it competitive.

    I say ‘presumably’ because of the issue of unsprung weight, while of minimal impact in non-competitive environments, may be problematic in competition.

    There presumably are ways to increase the RPMs of the in-wheel radial-flux motors spec’ed by Elaphe, but, like with all mechanical devices, there are practical limits. https://www.emobility-engineering.com/radial-flux-motors/ suggests to me (the material is totally over my comprehension) that RPMs of 2-3,000 are attainable through elements like magnet choice, placement and winding design, among others changes that would also affect torque availability, weight and other performance characteristics.

    This is the purview and mindset of racers who, with multiple in-wheel motors, will have to not only modify the stock motors, but modify them so that their individual performance remains balanced among the different power plants.

    I figure, assuming production starts ramping in 2023 that sometime after that some talented gear-heads will start crunching the numbers and come up with ways to expand the capabilities of the Aptera beyond its already substantial attributes. I can’t wait 😉

  • Ricky Camacho

    Member
    October 29, 2021 at 2:22 pm

    That why I’m buying one, I like it more as a sports car than an efficient car. AWD 250 miles battery also. I’m always playing around in https://www.motormatchup.com tweaking weight etc. hopefully we get a sport mode to at least unlock a little bit more HP or something fingers cross.

    • John Malcom

      Member
      October 29, 2021 at 6:41 pm

      Other places on the forum address the motor limitations for top speed. (Motor controller can only change the flux so fast. The motors are rated for higher peak Power (75kW) than the Aptera 50kW if you check the Elephe site under Direct Drive Motors, M700.

      https://in-wheel.com/en/solutions-2/direct-drive-in-wheel-motors/

      Of course anything to do the the “Stock” configuration will void any warranty, and it is not only the motor that would need mod’ng, all of the electronics for motor control, batter interface, and UI would need reworking as well. Maybe even more I an not aware of.

      Pretty expensive endeavor. 3.5 seconds to 60 is pretty good. Only a few super cars do better.

      Good luck!

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